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Seth
01-09-2003, 08:24 AM
I've added the /give command in the cafe to transfer tags.

Lemmie know if you have any problems with it!

wartortle
01-09-2003, 08:38 AM
And just like that, FQ becomes a team game. Get a couple of friends to play for a few days, and then they can give you all of their tags.

This game needs a small group of people who are untouchable... just like the top sellers, but even more rigged.

We'll see how it works out, but I'm very pessimistic. Even a couple of gold tags a day will give those with friends a free upgrade or two, while those playing alone are screwed.

redink1
01-09-2003, 12:36 PM
I'm pessimistic too... and multiple accounts are quite easy to do. I mean, if I'm on dial-up I can just disconnect, and re-dial and check to see if my IP changed, and if so I have myself a dummy account. If I have broadband, and it isn't a static IP, sorta the same thing. Or if all else fails, just go somewhere else to play as the other player (library, room down the hall, etc.)

Hrm... perhaps it would be better to limit the amount of tags you can transfer per day? Like for a max of 1 gold tag. Then abuse wouldn't be that bad, and it would still allow you to give someone a tag for whatever reason.

wartortle
01-09-2003, 01:12 PM
Quote[/b] (redink1 @ Jan. 09 2003,4:36)]Hrm... perhaps it would be better to limit the amount of tags you can transfer per day? Like for a max of 1 gold tag. Then abuse wouldn't be that bad, and it would still allow you to give someone a tag for whatever reason.
What might happen, if someone can be given a gold tag a day from someone? You've guessed it, someone makes half a dozen fake accounts (or as many as wanted), and rakes in the gold tags. Granted, after the first 20 days or so, the tags are not quite as valuable (as everything costs more), but early on, the extra tags are very helpful.

I just don't know why someone would give up their gold tags, to give to someone else, if there isn't some kind of collusion/rigging going on.

If someone REALLY needs a gold tag, make them pay back double to a bank or something.

redink1
01-09-2003, 03:17 PM
Hrm... then how about make it so you can only receive one gold tag a day? Makes more sense.

Anyway, I just checked out the Cafe, and found a bug. Using /info, it says I have 2 parlor visits left, when in fact I've used them up. It seems to report everything else correctly though.

wartortle
01-09-2003, 03:52 PM
Quote[/b] (redink1 @ Jan. 09 2003,7:17)]Hrm... then how about make it so you can only receive one gold tag a day? Makes more sense.
That sounds better than how it currently is. I gave away 11 gold tags to the same person today, and I'm going to keep doing that, until it's realised how crazy it currently is!

But the question remains, if this isn't a team game, why can you give people money?

Dukie
01-09-2003, 03:58 PM
I was there. He's right, it's crazy!!

redink1
01-09-2003, 04:07 PM
Quote[/b] ]I gave away 11 gold tags to the same person today, and I'm going to keep doing that, until it's realised how crazy it currently is!

Sounds fine to me... but ONLY if that 'same person' is me from now on http://www.rtsoft.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

wartortle
01-09-2003, 04:21 PM
Quote[/b] (redink1 @ Jan. 09 2003,8:07)]Sounds fine to me... but ONLY if that 'same person' is me from now on http://www.rtsoft.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif
And that's the entire point. Those people who are getting extra gold tags every day, have a huge advantage over those who don't. I'm just proving it (which is hurting my game, I know).

Lord.Gandalf
01-09-2003, 05:54 PM
Share the wealth wartortle.... http://www.rtsoft.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/sad.gif

Have I recently told you how much you mean to me, and how spectacular of a person you are?

01-09-2003, 06:31 PM
Maybe we should have a /donate command, that redirects all my players (Hi guys!) to PAYPAL.

And while we're at it, you can add a /poontang command, so wartortle can purchase a prostitute to be sent to my house. What's the current conversion rate from Gold Tags to US$ ?

-DrAndy

Lord.Gandalf
01-09-2003, 07:13 PM
Who wants gold tags??

I will sell you all my gold tags daily for a price. $$$

Bidding starts at $10.

wartortle
01-09-2003, 09:29 PM
As I mean so much to you, Lord, I am expecting a discount!

Lord.Gandalf
01-09-2003, 10:27 PM
http://www.rtsoft.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif

You mean a lot to me and I will give you a discount. http://www.rtsoft.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

Seth
01-10-2003, 12:24 AM
Hmm, I fully understand the abuse issues, I just didn't think anybody would so soon - wow! Tags have only actually been transferred by two people so far, each transferred like 11.

I think limiting people to being able to recieve a max of 1 tag a day is the answer. This way, 10 dupe accounts wouldn't help, you can only get 1 tag a day, and we can still see interesting things like "paying someone to send them a nice yangs" and things like that, which is the goal of allowing transfers.

Also, possible dupes/dupe attempts recently:

WARNING: 01-05 1:03 PM:User with IP 32.100.198.173 not allowed to create a new user. (already on as jackal676 (32.100.198.173) today)
WARNING: 01-05 8:05 PM:User with IP 24.169.201.59 not allowed to create a new user. (already on as scrubadub (24.169.201.59) today)
WARNING: 01-05 11:06 PM:User with IP 213.224.83.110 can't logon as nitronic because he already played as Banaan (213.224.83.110) today.
WARNING: 01-05 11:06 PM:User with IP 213.224.83.110 can't logon as nitronic because he already played as Banaan (213.224.83.110) today.
WARNING: 01-05 11:07 PM:User with IP 213.224.83.110 can't logon as nitronic because he already played as Banaan (213.224.83.110) today.
WARNING: 01-06 1:49 PM:User with IP 152.104.2.125 not allowed to create a new user. (already on as dustpan (152.104.2.125) today)
WARNING: 01-09 2:39 AM:User with IP 168.8.111.205 not allowed to create a new user. (already on as mista (168.8.111.205) today)
WARNING: 01-09 2:41 AM:User with IP 168.8.111.205 not allowed to create a new user. (already on as mista (168.8.111.205) today)

Deathstalker
01-10-2003, 12:51 AM
http://www.rtsoft.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/biggrin.gif you know tyhe Idea is a sound concept but I can relate to the concern over duplicate accounts as well:
WARNING: 01-04 10:16 AM:User with IP 213.40.71.50 can't logon as Sarah because he already played as BondageQueen (213.40.71.50) today.
WARNING: 01-04 12:32 PM:Script shouldn't be initted yet.
WARNING: 01-05 2:26 AM:get_range_from_age: Error, age 0 isn't valid.
WARNING: 01-05 2:26 AM:get_range_from_age: Error, age 0 isn't valid.
WARNING: 01-05 2:26 AM:get_range_from_age: Error, age 0 isn't valid.
WARNING: 01-05 2:26 AM:get_range_from_age: Error, age 0 isn't valid.
WARNING: 01-05 2:26 AM:get_range_from_age: Error, age 0 isn't valid.
WARNING: 01-05 2:26 AM:get_range_from_age: Error, age 0 isn't valid.
WARNING: 01-05 2:26 AM:get_range_from_age: Error, age 0 isn't valid.
WARNING: 01-05 2:26 AM:get_range_from_age: Error, age 0 isn't valid.
WARNING: 01-05 2:26 AM:get_range_from_age: Error, age 0 isn't valid.
WARNING: 01-05 2:26 AM:get_range_from_age: Error, age 0 isn't valid.
WARNING: 01-05 2:26 AM:get_range_from_age: Error, age 0 isn't valid.
WARNING: 01-05 2:26 AM:get_range_from_age: Error, age 0 isn't valid.
WARNING: 01-05 2:26 AM:get_range_from_age: Error, age 0 isn't valid.
WARNING: 01-05 2:26 AM:get_range_from_age: Error, age 0 isn't valid.
WARNING: 01-05 2:26 AM:get_range_from_age: Error, age 0 isn't valid.
WARNING: 01-05 2:26 AM:get_range_from_age: Error, age 0 isn't valid.
WARNING: 01-05 2:28 AM:User with IP 66.119.33.167 can't logon as iswear03 because he already played as Fluffy (66.119.33.167) today.
WARNING: 01-05 2:29 AM:User with IP 66.119.33.167 can't logon as iswear03 because he already played as Fluffy (66.119.33.167) today.
WARNING: 01-05 2:30 AM:User with IP 66.119.33.167 can't logon as iswear03 because he already played as Fluffy (66.119.33.167) today.
WARNING: 01-05 3:58 PM:User with IP 66.119.33.167 can't logon as iswear03 because he already played as Fluffy (66.119.33.167) today.
WARNING: 01-05 4:45 PM:User with IP 65.93.104.61 can't logon as Cookerguy's because he already played as Arbuckles (65.93.104.61) today.
WARNING: 01-05 4:45 PM:User with IP 65.93.104.61 can't logon as Cookerguy's because he already played as Arbuckles (65.93.104.61) today.
WARNING: 01-05 5:01 PM:User with IP 65.93.105.191 can't logon as Arbuckles because he already played as Cookerguy's (65.93.105.191) today.
WARNING: 01-05 5:05 PM:User with IP 65.93.104.159 can't logon as Cookerguy's because he already played as Arbuckles (65.93.104.159) today.
WARNING: 01-05 5:06 PM:User with IP 65.93.104.159 can't logon as Cookerguy's because he already played as Arbuckles (65.93.104.159) today.
WARNING: 01-05 5:20 PM:User with IP 217.35.49.167 can't logon as Mr T because he already played as rose (217.35.49.167) today.
WARNING: 01-05 7:29 PM:User with IP 65.93.102.52 can't logon as Arbuckles because he already played as Cookerguy's (65.93.102.52) today.
WARNING: 01-06 12:49 AM:User with IP 80.111.10.32 not allowed to create a new user. (already on as Mr. Yu Fu (80.111.10.32) today)
WARNING: 01-06 2:10 PM:User with IP 80.225.8.78 can't logon as The Hybrid Theorist because he already played as The Ragman (80.225.8.78) today.
WARNING: 01-06 2:10 PM:User with IP 80.225.8.78 can't logon as The Hybrid Theorist because he already played as The Ragman (80.225.8.78) today.
WARNING: 01-06 5:10 PM:User with IP 217.39.84.198 can't logon as Mr T because he already played as rose (217.39.84.198) today.
WARNING: 01-06 10:37 PM:User with IP 68.55.42.235 can't logon as Gwyndyn because he already played as Jesse (68.55.42.235) today.
WARNING: 01-07 6:55 AM:User with IP 62.64.233.19 not allowed to create a new user. (already on as Kibbi (62.64.233.19) today)
WARNING: 01-07 6:00 PM:User with IP 62.64.236.191 can't logon as Kibbi because he already played as HTP (62.64.236.191) today.
WARNING: 01-07 8:26 PM:User with IP 68.55.42.235 can't logon as Gwyndyn because he already played as Jesse (68.55.42.235) today.
WARNING: 01-08 10:15 AM:User with IP 203.218.199.171 not allowed to create a new user. (already on as dustpan (203.218.199.171) today)
WARNING: 01-08 12:15 PM:User with IP 62.64.216.241 not allowed to create a new user. (already on as Kibbi (62.64.216.241) today)
WARNING: 01-08 6:55 PM:Script shouldn't be initted yet.
WARNING: 01-08 10:44 PM:User with IP 24.70.95.206 not allowed to create a new user. (already on as fudgeERRR (24.70.95.206) today)
WARNING: 01-08 10:45 PM:User with IP 24.70.95.206 not allowed to create a new user. (already on as fudgeERRR (24.70.95.206) today)
WARNING: 01-08 10:47 PM:User with IP 24.70.95.206 not allowed to create a new user. (already on as fudgeERRR (24.70.95.206) today)
WARNING: 01-08 11:55 PM:User with IP 66.185.85.72 not allowed to create a new user. (already on as Paradigm (66.185.85.72) today)
WARNING: 01-08 11:55 PM:User with IP 66.185.85.72 not allowed to create a new user. (already on as Paradigm (66.185.85.72) today)
WARNING: 01-08 11:56 PM:User with IP 66.185.85.72 not allowed to create a new user. (already on as Paradigm (66.185.85.72) today)
WARNING: 01-09 12:04 AM:User with IP 66.185.85.72 not allowed to create a new user. (already on as Paradigm (66.185.85.72) today)
WARNING: 01-09 1:47 AM:User with IP 65.93.97.38 can't logon as Cookerguy's because he already played as Arbuckles (65.93.97.38) today.
WARNING: 01-09 8:08 AM:User with IP 212.219.56.198 can't logon as Jesus because he already played as Punkerbell (212.219.56.198) today.
WARNING: 01-09 8:09 AM:User with IP 212.219.56.198 can't logon as Jesus because he already played as Punkerbell (212.219.56.198) today.
WARNING: 01-09 8:09 AM:User with IP 212.219.56.198 not allowed to create a new user. (already on as Punkerbell (212.219.56.198) today)
WARNING: 01-09 11:32 AM:User with IP 80.192.155.66 not allowed to create a new user. (already on as Punkerbell (80.192.155.66) today)
WARNING: 01-09 11:34 AM:User with IP 80.192.155.66 not allowed to create a new user. (already on as Punkerbell (80.192.155.66) today)
WARNING: 01-09 11:35 AM:User with IP 168.8.111.205 not allowed to create a new user. (already on as slider (168.8.111.205) today)
WARNING: 01-09 12:05 PM:User with IP 168.8.111.205 not allowed to create a new user. (already on as slider (168.8.111.205) today)
WARNING: 01-09 12:38 PM:User with IP 168.8.111.205 not allowed to create a new user. (already on as slider (168.8.111.205) today)
WARNING: 01-09 4:21 PM:User with IP 24.57.83.101 not allowed to create a new user. (already on as Magnus (24.57.83.101) today)
WARNING: 01-09 4:22 PM:User with IP 24.57.83.101 not allowed to create a new user. (already on as Magnus (24.57.83.101) today)


so you see who I feel about this.....
http://www.rtsoft.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/alien.gif http://www.rtsoft.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/alien.gif

wartortle
01-10-2003, 10:33 AM
The solution to the dupe accounts, would be to delete both of them (the dupe and the original). Of course, dynamic IP addresses soon kill that idea though.

I am still against giving other people gold tags... but if someone can come up with a good reason why it should be possible, I am listening!

01-10-2003, 12:55 PM
Banaan is Nitronic, I already said that once. Nitronic is from Belgium, like me, Banaan is dutch (which we speak here) for banana. I think he said that wasn't true, but Nitronic is a little kid. He is Banaan.

Seth
01-10-2003, 12:58 PM
Wartortle, there are tons of reasons!-

One is helping a guy who is just "one silver short" of buying a new hearse and offers to pay back a gold. Another is being able to help a guy out who pyro's an enemy in common.

But the most important thing is *freedom* - tag transfer allows for emergent behavior that is not scripted/planned into the game.

IP security isn't perfect, there is a pretty big discussion on different/additional methods in an earlier thread but the bottom line is you're right, if both get deleted top players probably wouldn't risk duping, as it's very easy to forget and generate an IP warning to the admin.

He can also sort by IP's, and in most cases (a notable exception is AOL dialup) it's pretty clear who is duping, especially if you see a guy helping his other player out.

Anyway, thanks for the help guys. A one tag limit (on recieving) is now in place.

Also, you can click "Server Settings" from the main menu to see the tag transfer settings on any server now.

Also /info in the chat room now shows the correct fights per day. (thanks!)

mimifish
01-10-2003, 01:38 PM
I was kind of disappointed to see the tag transfer was put in instead of the borrowing/buying one tag from Bank. I think that is much better and can be used for everyone. On the other hand, tag transfer is probably limited to players who have some friends in the game. Of course, it might encourage people to bring friend to the game... But then the duping can be tricky since it might be even harder to decide if there really are two different people using similar IP's.

wartortle
01-10-2003, 05:40 PM
Sometimes, you can ask/beg for a tag (as you know, Mimifish), and you're lucky. Of course, if your begging goes unanswered, everyone who knows about it, knows you're loaded with tags. If only they were safe, like in a bank (for a fee!).

It does look like we're stuck with the "can give friends tags" option... the current RT test server game has advanced a little, but for the first few days, those extra golds will add up. I've said all I need to on this subject though!

redink1
01-10-2003, 08:08 PM
From the server configuration html page:
Quote[/b] ]Amount of tags players can receieve by /give per day: 1Funny way of spelling receive http://www.rtsoft.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/smile.gif

Lord.Gandalf
01-10-2003, 10:56 PM
That's some darn good spelling then thar there Seth.. http://www.rtsoft.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/tounge.gif